www.pegasos.org :: View topic - The AmigaOS IRC session news from 2005-12-28
Home   News   Forum   Gallery   


 Log in Problems?
 New User? Sign Up!


Currently no members online:)

You are an anonymous user. You can register for free by clicking here
There are 1 unlogged users online !

Latest Web Links

Latest Downloads

Post new topic   Reply to topic
View previous topic Printable version Log in to check your private messages View next topic
Author Message
Post subject: The AmigaOS IRC session news from 2005-12-28  PostPosted: Dec 28, 2005 - 18:51
Order of the Butterfly
Order of the Butterfly

Joined: Sep 08, 2003
Posts: 1370
Location: EU
Here is the main news from Hyperion:

- Release of AmigaOS Update 4 in Jan 2006.
- SCSI support for LSI/Symbios based cards (53c8xx based).
- Still looking for a new hardware to run AmigaOS4 on, some mentioned are Pegasos2 and the Troika Project.

Join the Pegasos.Org Team at Seti@Home.

Last edited by Trizt on Dec 28, 2005 - 20:48; edited 2 times in total
 View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger ICQ Number 
Reply with quote Back to top
Post subject:   PostPosted: Dec 28, 2005 - 19:50
Order of the Butterfly
Order of the Butterfly

Joined: Sep 08, 2003
Posts: 1370
Location: EU
Here is the whole IRC session
<Rogue> Okay, hello all :)
<EntilZha> Ok, is this thing on ?
<DaveyD> yes
<EntilZha> Hello All!
<Rogue> *clears throat*
<DaveyD> hi EntilZha and Rogue
<Rogue> Hello everybody... first of all, I would like to say a few things that would otherwise be asked at least 100 times :)
<Rogue> As you have probably already guessed, there will be no OS 4 release this year. There are reasons for that which I would like to explain
<Rogue> The main reason is the unavailability of hardware. As you all know, AmigaOne's are not available right now, so we are not in a position to offer an OS 4 with a matching hardware.
<Rogue> We DO think that once we release AmigaOS4.0, there will be a general interest in the news, in media, etc. We will get a lot of interest from people outside the amiga market, and they will ask where they can buy it.
<Rogue> If we tell them they cannot buy it right now and need to wait until the hardware is available, then this will take away a lot of momentum that the release will generate.
<Rogue> Hence we decided to postpone the release until such time as a hardware platform IS available.
<Rogue> *coughs* so much for the bad news.
<Rogue> Now the good news. First of all, since we don't have OS 4 out now as planned, there will be...
<Rogue> Update #4
<Rogue> Update #4 will come out early january, and will be again a quite comprehensive update. It will include, among other things...
<Rogue> ... and, well, everything else is included too. It's going to be an installable ISO again
<Rogue> It will be more or less what the beta testers have now
<Rogue> Secondly, one thing that was recently added to OS 4 is SCSI support.
<Rogue> Stephane Guillard has written a driver for LSI/Symbios based cards (53c8xx based).
<Rogue> Finally, you will wonder when new hardware is going to be available.
<Rogue> I'm afraid I cannot answer that question, BUT we are working with several hardware companies (Troika is one of them but not the only one) that want to provide hardware ofr AmigaOS4.0
<Rogue> Alright, that's it from me. I'd say on to the questions.
<Coder> Ok hold on for the first one.
<Coder> <Alkaron> Will there be any kind of software / drivers updating service (notice or automatic via internet) in the final os4.0..
<Rogue> As you may have heard, there already is some sort of updater program called AmiUpdate. We don't know yet if this will make it public or not, but it is certainly an option...
<Rogue> Basically we will consider it but it depends on the infrastructure.
<Eric_S> Will update #4 include SNAP?
<Rogue> next please :)
<Rogue> No, SNAP will not be included
<Rogue> next
<EntilZha> Not much. Basically, it's very near to what would have been the final release.
<EntilZha> There are some bits and pieces that we will only release in the final version...
<EntilZha> This gives us the opportunity to test them some more internally...
<_Steve_> [VidarL]: Given the popularity of "safe" languages, do you have any plans to release a virtual machine based programming language like Java or .Net, with official Reaction bindings?
<EntilZha> There are currently no plans from our side.
<Rogue> We are planning things like Python
<Rogue> as a replacement for AREXX. But nothing yet in terms of Java
<EntilZha> NEXT
<Rigo> <codesmith> QUESTION: When can we expect an updated SDK?
<EntilZha> It wil probably l be release shortly after update #4
<EntilZha> next
<Alchemy> Invizix: http://www.perl.com/doc/manual/html/Porting/README.amiga.html
<Rogue> There will be no OS4 ROM and there will be no reflashing for CyberstormPPC cards.
<Rogue> next
<_Steve_> [^eliot]: How good does memory protection, virtual memory and resource tracking work in current OS4? Which limitations are there?
<EntilZha> Memory protection in the sense that programs run completely isolated does not work on current AmigaOS... it's technically not possible since all existing programs rely on shared memory
<Coder> <etho> just wanted to add a question (if possible) "what are current relationships between eyetech an hyperion"
<EntilZha> The only thing we currently do is protect certain parts from access by user programs...
<EntilZha> Resource tracking is implemented basically, but it is not yet used by everyone, so basically, it's disabled by default... there are too many problems still (resources being freed by other tasks than the original allocator...)
<Rogue> I don't think there is more to say on that.
<Rogue> next
<Eric_S> <ssolie> QUESTION: Mesa looks really interesting. How much integration into AmigaOS are you expecting to do? Will there be a mesa.library for example?
<Rogue> *coughs* :)
<Rogue> Alright, about Mesa...
<Rogue> This will not be tied to Mesa but to a concept of an installable driver that can override all or part of the standard OpenGL pipeline.
<Rogue> About our contact with Amiga:
<Rogue> Yes, we are in contact with Amiga. I don't know specifics, since this is a management job, so I can't say more about it.
<Rogue> Next
<Outcast> <Deniil> QUESTION: Will the Grim Reaper be able to catch crashes that occur within graphics/intuition.library caused by incorrect
<Outcast> pointers, or will it lock upp the system in OS4 final as well? This problem is very annoying during development and testing
<EntilZha> Illegal access in critical parts of the system will always lead to such "hard" crashes. This is a problem of the AmigaOS design in general, and we basically inherit that.
<EntilZha> There's no real way for the GrimReaper to catch these... these things will be addressed later
<EntilZha> next
<Coder> Some days ago in the forums it was said that the RKM's would be renewed and printed again. Could you share some more info on that?
<EntilZha> We intent to bring the RKM's up to current specs.
<EntilZha> next
<Rogue> Update #4 : no, most likely not. OS4 final: Yes.
<EntilZha> That's DVi support Rogue's talking about
<Rogue> AmigaInput: yes that is going to be included in update #4, most likely including the USB HID driver... I have played Descent Freespace wth my Saitek X52 FCS and it rocks :)
<Rogue> next
<Outcast> <Jurassic_OS4> QUESTION: Can you comment on any possible CPU upgrades that may or may not be available for the A1 ?
<Outcast> [19:58:10]
<EntilZha> No
<Outcast> :)
<EntilZha> Sorry, we are no hardware company
<EntilZha> next
<_Steve_> [dEF_bASE]: Question: Hardware support (specifically, driver development for anything other than the most popular hardware) is a serious issue for Linux. How do you intend to address driver development and hardware support to avoid (or reduce) the issues that Linux has?
<Rogue> We're in the same boat. Hardware support WILL be an issue, more so since many hardware companies will not part with their specs.
<Rogue> We can borrow from Linux or write our own drivers, or support thrid party drivers.
<Rogue> But yeah, that is going to be an issue... you will not be able ATM to plug in, say, a Volari graphics card and expect it to work.
<Rogue> :(
<Rogue> next
<Coder> <lazi> Will there be socks support in roadshow?
<EntilZha> Uhm, good question... Frankly, I don't know... if Olaf is here, can somebody voice him :S
<Rogue> Something I forgot to mention about Update #4:
<Rogue> It will have 64 bit DOS support
<Rogue> Sure..
<Rogue> There are new functions that accept 64 bit file offsets and sizes. There are also new DOS package types that will allow you to use files that are larger than 2 GB.
<Rogue> currently everything is 32 bit, and signed, too.
<Outcast> YES
<Rogue> so that means 2GB is mostly the limit.
<Outcast> you beauty
<Rogue> *coughs*
<Rogue> Erm, seems Olaf isn't here... Next I'd say
<DaveyD> <FryGuy> question: will os4 support tvout?
<Rogue> Update 4 won't.
<Rogue> For the final version, I think this is planned (for cards that support it like Radeon), so it would be yes.
<Rogue> next
<Eric_S> <haymiggaOS4> Question: Using AmigaOS4 partitioned harddrives connected via USB is not working well to say the least in pre3, will this work in Update4?
<EntilZha> There was a bug in CrossDos that was causing trouble. This is fixed, and the fix will make it into update 4
<EntilZha> Other than that, I can't say, because I don't know what the problem is that you're having...
<EntilZha> next
<Outcast> MiMe_OS4> QUESTION: will the radeon drivers be updated for #4 (overlay for example)?
<EntilZha> Overlay is still being worked on, but it's not in update 4, sorry
<EntilZha> All Radeons from R100 up to R2xx and RV2xx are supported by 3d drivers
<EntilZha> All others only 2d at the moment.
<EntilZha> next
<_Steve_> [ssolie]: QUESTION: Mesa looks really interesting. How much integration into AmigaOS are you expecting to do? Will there be a mesa.library for example?
<EntilZha> *coughs* See above
<EntilZha> Already been answered
* Rogue points upwards
<EntilZha> Uhm... next ?
<Coder> Are you spending more time on the OS4 version for the "classic" Amiga now that you are waiting with the final release for new hardware?
<EntilZha> What we currently do is testing and bugfixing... even final releases contain bugs, so here's our chance to reduce the number of bugs that will be in the final version (and replace them by new bugs :S )
<EntilZha> next
<EntilZha> Yes, there will be. Unfortunately, this has been on backburner for far too long, and we apologize for that.
<EntilZha> next
<EntilZha> No
<EntilZha> next :)
<Rogue> Well, my personal opinion: No.
<Rogue> BUT
<Rogue> Since I am certainly not a lawyer, I cannot and will not comment on legal issues... I don't mind, but the company might :)
<Rogue> There are commercial interests to be taken into account.
<EntilZha> Basically, this is a question for the management, and not for us... we only work here :)
<Rogue> Yup :)
<EntilZha> Personally, I wouldn't mind either.
<Rogue> next
<_Steve_> [%Jurassic_OS4]: QUESTION: Who will be responsible for the OS4 marketing. We all know how poor C= marketing was after the 64 was released with there be a hi profile scheme ?
<Rogue> Erm, good question.
<Rogue> I am a developer, it certainly isn't going to be me :)
<Rogue> Other than that, well the website is more or less a beginning of our marketing...
<Rogue> So I cannot really answer that.
<Rogue> next
<Coder> <damned> question: can finally use joystick/jopad with update 4?
<Rogue> Yes.
<Rogue> AmigaInput is going to be included
<Rogue> There is a driver for USB HID devices which is capable of driving a number of USB joysticks.
<Rogue> Not all are supported, we are working on a compatibility list.
<Rogue> But quite a number of devices already work... Like I said above, my Saitek FCS works quite well..
<EntilZha> We played Freespace with this: http://www.saitek.de/prod/x52.htm
<Rogue> next :)
<Rogue> That is a definitive YES!
<Rogue> We'Re already lookng into this.
<Rogue> Multicore CPU's are going to be commonplace in a few years time, we cannot afford to miss that.
<Rogue> Especially with CELL
<EntilZha> There are currently "legacy issues" with multicore support, so this is going to be post OS4.0 (4.x)
<Rogue> This is mostly about Forbid lockign which chokes performance if used too often.
<Rogue> We're working on getting this out of the system, and we're working on solutions for dual/multicore CPU support and special CPU support like CELL
<Rogue> next
<Outcast> <cyberhusky> Question: Is raytracer Real 4D still an issue for AOs4?
<Rogue> Yes
<Rogue> Still being worked on, though it is going slowly...
<Rogue> We've moved it to a third party though.
<Rogue> next
<_Steve_> [GuruMeditation]: QUESTION: Commodore was quite excellent when it came to documentation. Will you, or anyone else print any documentation for OS4, or will it be digital only?
<Rogue> Good question.
<Rogue> Digital documentation is going to be the major source of information, but we're looking into things like a printed manual.
<Rogue> There most likely *will* be a printed manual for the final release.
<EntilZha> And a "big box"
<Rogue> next
<Coder> Orgin: Do you plan, at some point, to include a proper GUI based tool for task/process management? Such as listing all running processes, sending signals, changing priorities, killing individual tasks etc.
<EntilZha> The whole scheduler/task system will be reworked completely in post 4.0. As such, these possibilities are probably going to be addressed late, including such a tool.
<Rogue> There has been lots of work recently within exec and DOS to make graceful exit of crashed task more viable
<Rogue> Resource tracking *is* functional, it just needs to be extended to things like graphics and intuition.
<Rogue> Whether this will work out for 4.0 or be pused back for 4.1 is not yet decided... I'd bet on 4.1
<Rogue> next
<Eric_S> <Guest646> Question: Are there any plans for a speech program in OS4 as there was in the original Amiga?
<EntilZha> Short answer: No
<EntilZha> Long answer: There's been a candidate for a speech replacement for OS4, but it has not yet been pirsued. It's basically a "minor issue", and there is freely available software that can do the same.
<EntilZha> next
<Rogue> We're currently working on some stuff but I cannot disclose what it is, nor can I say when it will be available.
<EntilZha> Basically, we are working full time on OS4
<Rogue> things go slow... we've got an OS to finish too :)
<Rogue> next
<EntilZha> Some of the features:
<Rogue> Basically improve on what we have now.
<Rogue> Yup :)
<Rogue> (good answer)
<Rogue> *coughs* next :)
<_Steve_> [tons]: Will hardware/software that requires proper Zorro and Classic Amiga Video support, such as the Video Toaster and Video Toaster Flyer system, work properly with OS4?
<EntilZha> Yes, provided the drivers are written correctly.
<EntilZha> There's nothing that prevents you from accessing the Zorro bus, or the video hardware... however, the drivers must work with the emulation.
<EntilZha> next
<Rogue> Aye! No comment :)
<Rogue> Erm... okay...
<Rogue> Pegasos 2 is a potential hardware platform for OS 4.
<Rogue> There is an initial "cost" involved for a port, in fact, for any port of OS 4 to a different hardware platform.
<Rogue> On some occasions (like the hardware platforms mentioned in our introduction) we'Re working on that with the hardware manufacturer.
<Rogue> For the Pegasos 2, we would need to do that ourselves. We're currently not ready to do that.
<Rogue> That is the reason why there is no OS4 on the peg yet.
<Rogue> PDA:
<Rogue> Yes AmigaOS4 *does* run on an existing PDA.
<EntilZha> Yeah, Workbench booting on a 240x320 display: A sight to see
<DaveyD> lol
<DaveyD> if Windows can do it ;)
<EntilZha> I can not dsclose that without killing 519 people, sorry
<Outcast> on Coke ?
<Coder> Drinks are on DaveyD
<DaveyD> EntilZha your belgain, of course
<EntilZha> Depends on what you mix into the Coke
<Outcast> true
* EntilZha remembers being drunk on Coke+Cognac
* DaveyD locks the door
<EntilZha> Hmm... thoughts...
<EntilZha> Well, we do have our plans, but it all depends of course on the present, i.e. sales of OS4
<EntilZha> Some of the plans we already gave a glimpse on, some others are not disclosed yet
* DaveyD opens the room in a moment
<DaveyD> now drink up
<Outcast> Round of applause
<EntilZha> You're welcome. Thanks all for listening

Join the Pegasos.Org Team at Seti@Home.
 View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger ICQ Number 
Reply with quote Back to top
Post subject:   PostPosted: Dec 28, 2005 - 23:18

Joined: Sep 09, 2005
Posts: 52

""<ackcontrols> The PowerVixxen LT has gone to production, docs are being polished up.
<ackcontrols> Yes, OS4 will be bundled with the Power Vixxen LT
<ackcontrols> End of january give or take. ""

This is confirmed info via E-mail as well. Smile
 View user's profile Send private message  
Reply with quote Back to top
Post subject:   PostPosted: Dec 29, 2005 - 07:33
Order of the Butterfly
Order of the Butterfly

Joined: Jan 14, 2004
Posts: 1939
Location: Karlsborg,Sverige
well and all docs to powervixen vill be out so you could port linux or morphos to is...

 View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website ICQ Number 
Reply with quote Back to top
Post subject:   PostPosted: Dec 29, 2005 - 07:54
Order of the Butterfly
Order of the Butterfly

Joined: Aug 26, 2003
Posts: 1784
Location: Malmö
<Rogue> No, SNAP will not be included

I wonder if it has been dropped altogether. SNAP seems like a good idea, by a company that has already proven itself in the 2D world ages ago. It would be interesting to know if the system only looks good on the surface or if it really does deliver.

I need this baby in a month send me nine women!
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website ICQ Number 
Reply with quote Back to top
Display posts from previous:     
Jump to:  
All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Post new topic   Reply to topic
View previous topic Printable version Log in to check your private messages View next topic
Powered by PNphpBB2 © 2003-2004 The PNphpBB Group
All logos and trademarks in this site are property of their respective owner.
The comments are property of their posters, all the rest © 2004-2012 by pegasos.org